#52 Why Your Evergreen System Might Be Failing: Expert Tips from Nicki K
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Nicki: [00:00:00] If your evergreen system is so amazing, why do you have to do a live event to sell it? If your evergreen system is so amazing, you should be able to use your evergreen system to sell your evergreen system.
Nicki: And it's just that kind of, we're so used to just consuming stuff and being like, right, great. Listen, that's, that's so exciting. We all as consumers and also as business owners selling to people, we have to make sure that Everything that we're doing lines up with how we put ourselves out in the world, that we have integrity and that we're actually holding up a mirror.
Nicki: Now that'sā
[00:01:00]
Claire: Another episode for the small town entrepreneur podcast. I'm your host, Claire Bouvier. And we have something really exciting to talk about today.
Claire: That is really interesting because it's really focusing on the unique blend of psychology, strategy, and then what we all need is some straight, to the point, tested results. So I would love everyone, there's going to be a couple of ways I might pronounce this, but meet Nikki Kroshek. There. That's the, that's the Polish Krawczyk.
Nicki: Yeah. It's, we say Krawczyk, but like, yeah, Polish people are like, you say your name wrong. I'm like, yeah.
Claire: Yeah. Well, I'm not Polish. I just have Polish influence, but Nikki is the CEO also of the founder of Nikki K Media, which we will push you to throughout this episode. Thanks for being here for another week with the Small Town Entrepreneur Podcast.
Claire: Nikki. Welcome. Yay. [00:02:00] Thanks for having me, Claire. Take care. Like I said, it when we were offline, you remind me of someone. And if anyone in the audience is listening to the RSS feed or the YouTube channel, please tell me. Yeah, but also like
Nicki: be gentle. Cause I'm a real human too. If it's mean,
Claire: just keep it
Nicki: to yourselves.
Claire: Yes, this is fair. But I know it's some great celebrity. It'll come to me. So we're going to jump right into it. I'm not one for small talk as people know. And. We really want to know what is it that entrepreneurs today, entrepreneurs, people working for a company for themselves, what is it? Is happening in sales.
Claire: Why you're so passionate about looking at the psychology of sales and why is there such a huge misconception when business owners are trying to attain clients, there's this huge misconception. And where does psychology come into the mix?
Nicki: Um, Well, I mean, you couldn't separate sales from [00:03:00] psychology if you tried.
Nicki: Unfortunately, most people try, they try to separate psychology from it. Well, what's Daniel Pink to sell as human, right? We are. Exactly. Persuasion is, it's just part of what we do. Unfortunately I think the biggest problem is that so many of the tactics that we have been taught again and again, and have been repeated ad nauseum, just don't actually work.
Nicki: With real life, they might have worked for a hot second when the concept was brand new, but they don't actually work in, in real life in a lot of ways. A lot of the things that we are taught to do or advised to do in the echo chamber, that is the digital marketing arena actually penalize people for having lives.
Nicki: penalize people for going about their lives and prevent them from getting engaged with us and purchasing from us. Why is that? Um, [00:04:00] Great question. I think that a lot of what we do and a lot of what we're coached to do as business owners is very us focused. Like, Oh, this works for me. This is how I want to do things.
Nicki: This is, I saw someone else do it and therefore I should do it the exact same way and A lot of us don't take the time and it's not necessarily our fault because if you don't have a background in marketing in messaging, the way that the way that some of us do, it makes sense that you would just kind of do what other people tell you to do, but.
Nicki: When you do that, there's kind of no surprise that you don't see the results you want to see. Like the, just as an example, you know, we were taught for so many years. Okay. Have people do, do a live webinar, do a live event, whatever, have them sign up and, and make them attend. Don't even give them a, don't even give them a, a recording.
Nicki: Exactly. Don't give it to them because then they have to show up and they have to be there. And when you first hear it, you're like, Oh, okay. Yes, yes, yes. Then, you know, [00:05:00] if somebody wants to be there, they're going to be there. There's that much more reason to be there until you take a step back and go, well, now, wait a minute.
Nicki: What if I were on the other side of it? And Claire, I know you've done the same thing plenty of times where you see somebody else's event and you're like, Oh, you know, I'll sign up for that. I want to see what they have to say. It's 6 PM tonight. Great. I'll sign up for it. And at 10 AM, that makes a lot of sense.
Nicki: But as your day goes on, things happen. You get busier, you get tired, or you know, your, your sister brings her kids over, just life happens. You know me? Yeah, right? Exactly. Like, ooh. Life happens. And this person who, who's genuinely interested in attending and, and hearing what you have to say now can't be there just because they're busy.
Nicki: They have a life and what you've said is effectively is you have a life and you've chosen your life over my webinar and therefore I'm punishing you for it. Well, wait, what? Why would we do that? And especially on top of the fact that We [00:06:00] have paid, whether we literally paid via ads or we paid by a time and energy to get everybody on that list.
Nicki: And when we say, Oh, you didn't make me the top priority in your life. You didn't make me and my webinar, the top priority in your life. Well, then forget about it. Good luck next time. Like
Claire: that doesn't even make any sense, but it's so great. You're saying this. Because, oh my goodness, think of how many companies that they don't provide replays.
Claire: It's like, they don't want that. And, and I think you're right that there's so much noise out there that like, if we do put that pressure on them, well, numbers are going to get smaller and smaller and uptake is smaller and smaller. Exactly. It's
Nicki: just, there's one thing that I would ask people or suggest that people take away from our discussion today, it's just, Think about things before you do them.
Nicki: Think to yourself, does this really make sense? If I were [00:07:00] on the other side of it,
Claire: would this
Nicki: feel good to me or would it feel cruddy? cause there's absolutely a way to put together a training but you don't have to be like, you have tomorrow to watch it or else, or you have to be here, you know, you can put it together in a supportive way, where it's people opt in for it, you give them a couple of days to watch it, and you actually encourage them to split that viewing, over a couple of days because people have lives and you give them a deadline because everything that we do has to have a deadline.
Nicki: I'm glad you said that. Okay, good. Yes. Yes. It's because, well, that's another element of psychology, right? Like as human beings, we don't take action unless we have some kind of deadline. There's a reason why every coupon has a deadline. we don't take action. We don't make decisions unless we have a deadline, which is part of the reason why some people kind of go in the other direction and go, Oh, I get it.
Nicki: I'm supposed to be supportive. I want to help people purchase. So you know what I'm going to do? I'm just Put my course up on my website and let [00:08:00] people buy it whenever they want to. Okay, well, that would be another example of like, okay, great. In one way you're trying to be supportive, but on the other side, you're not thinking about the way humans work.
Claire: No sense of urgency.
Nicki: Exactly. If you can buy something at any time. You won't, you're just going to keep that tab open on your computer and be like, yeah, okay, I mean, you know, eventually come back and, and the thing is, that attention and motivation it dwindles, right? It wanes. it's at the peak when people first follow us, find us all that kind of stuff.
Nicki: And just. Because it's a chemical state. it's just naturally what it does,
Claire: It dwindles and it wanes.
Claire: I love this because you know what, full disclosure, I am caught on that hamster wheel too.
Claire: Like you said, whoever is the noisiest or loudest, sometimes does win in the game, sometimes for us, you know, for people like me, where you're Sometimes you're going to sell something for the first time.
Claire: You're a content creator, and then you put something out and someone's telling you, and a lot of people are saying the same thing. [00:09:00] So it's really nice to have the disruption of, people like you'd be like, Hey, whoa, like let's take a step back and look at this. And I love in your work, you talk about these emotional triggers that are really part of the philosophy and how you approach it.
Claire: What are some of these triggers that. As someone listening right now can sense like in their audience, what are things that they need to keep in mind that they do stop and think, like you said, and think about, you know, if I was on the other side, well, yeah, I want to watch it at seven o'clock at night, a replay, stop and play when I'm in the bath on my own terms and having a glass of wine.
Claire: And I don't want to be sitting at my desk and trying to do a million things and listening to that. do you have some specific tangible or things that we can relate to some of these triggers that we can look at? Yeah, absolutely.
Nicki: there really kind of a couple of different things that are there are some emotions that you want to dig into that are just number one, going to help build that [00:10:00] trust between your, in you and your audience, but also help them build that Faith in your expertise. So the first one is validation of their previous experience. And what I mean is that everybody who finds us has some experience with something else that they've tried to find the solution to what we offer. They've tried to find it with somebody else, right? Maybe they've read an article, maybe they've taken another course.
Nicki: Maybe they did a one on one, maybe they worked with a consultant, something like that. Like, let's say somebody. teaches a course about how to create really effective quizzes. Right. But there's a very, very. My new chance that someone, if that's what you do, that someone signs up for your list has never heard of quizzes before, right?
Nicki: Like they've probably tried it. Maybe they've been, exactly. Maybe they listened to a blog post, but for some reason, there was some block that kept them from doing it. From moving forward with it. Something that kept them from being immediately successful with it. So the first thing to do is to validate the [00:11:00] fact that they have not yet been successful with them.
Nicki: And, and again, there could be multiple reasons and you have, you have the opportunity to kind of dig into that, but for some reason, there's been something that has kept them from being successful because if they had found a simple, easy to follow path, that was incredibly successful, they would need you.
Nicki: They would already be there. So the, one of the first things you want to do is to validate that previous experience and just let them know that it's not their fault that they haven't been successful yet because it isn't their fault. They just haven't gotten the right information, right? Or the right steps to succeed or they haven't worked with the right person.
Nicki: So you can validate the fact. Like Nikki, today
Claire: on the podcast. Yes. Yes. Yes. Nikki, this guy right here. Media,
Nicki: yeah. . Yeah, there's a reason why they haven't been successful before. and also there are a lot of emotions attached to that too. There's probably a lot of frustration.
Nicki: There's probably some disbelief, some [00:12:00] cynicism. And there's probably some, frustration. So I'm like, okay, well, yeah, I want this. I'm going to sign up for their email list. But like, I don't even know. Cause I tried before or read this article and just seemed really hard. And I know they say it's so easy with the tack, but I tried it with the tack and I couldn't, you know, all of that kind of stuff, validate that.
Nicki: But then the next step to that, you don't want to stop just at the validation. After validating that, you want to explain to them why the things that they've tried before haven't worked. So what you're going to do is you're going to say, hey, because the great thing is that there's a lot of bad information out there, right?
Nicki: If there were only good information, people wouldn't need you. They're trying to follow bad information, bad systems. So what you want to come in and say is, like, okay, look, you've probably heard. You probably heard you have to create your quizzes this way. You probably heard whatever a prevalent piece of information is out there.
Nicki: You're going to say, right. You probably heard this and then you can say, but actually. That's not true. It doesn't work for this [00:13:00] reason. And so that first step, that first, the first half of it makes them go, Oh my gosh. Mindset shift. Exactly. It's not my fault. And they understand exactly why it didn't work.
Nicki: Right? Which is very, very key. And the first half of that trust factor. The second half of it is to say, Okay, but here's what does work. Right? And why it works. And once they get that, and there are a couple of things that you're going to do to support that and really, really drive that home, but once they understand that, it's a light bulb for them, right?
Nicki: It comes on. Suddenly, they get it. They feel, they truly get it. feel validated for the fact that they haven't been successful before. They feel hope that they're, they understand why they haven't been successful. They also understand what could work for them. And they feel hope. And also just as importantly, now they're bought into you and what you have to offer and the way that you think and your system.
Nicki: And that makes them go, Okay, I wanna know more. [00:14:00] Tell me more. And all of that. When you stack that along with some other things on top of, and then do that a couple of times over by the end of it makes them go, I'm in, I want this, this, you get me. I want this system.
Claire: And I like that. That's a ultimately everyone's trying to do is you get me and creating.
Claire: You know, you talk a lot is creating that trust and affinity with your, with the people that are sitting in front of you and listening. And I think that's what it is, is that you want someone that it's not their first time doing surgery on you, and it's interesting mentioning something that, and I think it resonates what you're saying.
Claire: I was listening to a podcast with Alex Hermosi and it's funny, a lot of us you know, entrepreneurs, business owners, we go in thinking we're in one type of business. And then we focus so much on like, okay, you know, he talks about, he thought he was in the business of creating gyms, but really he realized he was just in the world of marketing and sales.
Claire: It doesn't matter the plan he was building for the, and [00:15:00] every, and I think that's what starts happening, correct me if I'm wrong, is a lot of businesses That are successful are so focused on made lead gen marketing and sales of the actual product itself. How much attention did they spend on it?
Claire: Because they're so focused on this other business of creating. And so then as a result, we are the victims. We hear the wrong message because it's the loudest and they had more money to push this messaging out. is that, do you, well, you
Nicki: know what? I, I, yes, we are absolutely competing against that.
Nicki: And, and part of the thing is that, it's really easy to look super successful on Instagram and on Facebook. And I don't even just mean like the dude standing next to somebody else's Ferrari or whatever. Like I don't even mean that, but just like. Yay, here I am in my house and everything's so wonderful.
Nicki: And it's, and sometimes that's legitimate. Absolutely. That you were doing pictures of me and my house. And, but at the same time, everybody looks like that. Right. So it can be very hard. And I think we want to, just as humans, we want to look at pictures [00:16:00] and be like, I don't know, she, she looks nice and she seems to have a good life in front of her house and up there she's in, in Greece or wherever, but yeah.
Nicki: Right. Next year, but we have to be more discerning as consumers, we have to be more discerning and that in our messaging, we have to actually call that stuff out and we have to call out the things that other people are saying that don't actually make sense. Like one of the things that makes me absolutely.
Nicki: Nuts that I find just just completely wild. So clearly the the what we're talking about right now is an automated sales system. I don't call it evergreen because it's kind of different from from ever Traditional evergreen and evergreen funnels. It's it's different from that And we can talk about how I built it and how I We haven't proved it on our other brands first, but one of the things that I just find wild, right, is there are other people out there selling evergreen systems and, and best of luck to them, more power to them, but I will [00:17:00] periodically see people say, like, Oh my gosh, my evergreen system is so amazing for selling your courses and your programs.
Nicki: Meet up with me live on Tuesday night and I'm going to show you exactly why it's so great and how it works. Well, now, wait a minute. What? If your evergreen system is so amazing, why do you have to do a live event to sell it? If your evergreen system is so amazing, you should be able to use your evergreen system to sell your evergreen system.
Nicki: And it's just that kind of, we're so used to just consuming stuff and being like, right, great. Listen, that's, that's so exciting. We all as consumers and also as business owners selling to people, we have to make sure that Everything that we're doing lines up with how we put ourselves out in the world, that we have integrity and that we're actually holding up a mirror.
Nicki: Now that's not a message I talk about. Cause I don't want to not a message to talk about a tongue. Cause I don't want to be like, look at them, you know, but,
Claire: but [00:18:00] that's the reality. I think sometimes we do need to do that though, because this is why I love having you on the pod because I've interviewed people.
Claire: We look at people that are everybody has different trains of thought where they've come. They all come from different backgrounds. And I really want the listener right now to really consider like, okay, how am I showing up for my audience? What does this look like when you talked about, the evergreen content, but also doing a live webinar that they need to go and creating that other sense of urgency and proving to them.
Claire: Can you give me an example? Of a business owner, what they could start doing today. How do they build that strong connection online? Especially we're in a really weird time in the world. I don't know if you can feel it. I talk to so many people. There's a lot of confusion. There's a lot of heavyweights, you know, there's so much different messaging post pandemic during the pandemic.
Claire: Some people are feeling. Finding a completely new rhythm in their life. They're readjusting. I [00:19:00] feel like it's like, okay, it's over the pandemic, but the sentiments and everything else along with it there's been a huge systemic shift in the way we work. There's been so many, I don't know how to say it, but so many shifts in so many different sectors and industries and, and, and we're all left kind of feeling, okay, what is the direction now that I'm supposed to take?
Claire: Like, I hate my job. I have kids at home. I have to show up for someone that I don't, I don't believe in. Do I start working for myself? And if I do that, well, I have five followers on LinkedIn, you know these are the conversation I'm hearing. So I'm curious, like, where do we start today? Where do we navigate building that?
Claire: Authenticity, even though it's overused, but that like connection with this audience and how do we give them what you're saying is meeting them where they are validating their experiences and their strengths and who they are and and and disproving this, these myths and kind of creating this new direction.
Claire: [00:20:00] What does that look like? Yeah.
Nicki: what you just laid out there is a great, like, a list of things to address on your social media, right? Like, all right, tell people this, hey, I'm seeing this and guess what? but taking a step back from that, what am I going to do?
Nicki: What's good? that's actually a really great place to start. And I know it doesn't sound like that. And I know it's, it's very, very confusing, but taking that moment to evaluate, What you want and what you're doing and what is working and what isn't working. you know, the sunk cost fallacy of like, I put in so much effort into this, therefore it has to work.
Nicki: But if it's not working, it's not working, you know, back in, in 2018 I had been. So we have a three brand company. My background is in copywriting. So the first brand I created is is the Comprehensive Copywriting Academy that teaches people to become professional copywriters. And I was, was working on that basically from 2012 to 2018.
Nicki: And I was doing all of that. All the things. I was trying live [00:21:00] launching, I was trying offering as a membership, I was trying this, I was trying that, and, and I finally, at the end of 2018, I got so frustrated because just none of it was, working or none of it was consistently working and so I, I stepped back and went, okay, Wait a minute here.
Nicki: I'm doing all these things. People are telling me all these big names are saying, I have to do this. And we can talk about what works for the big names, why that won't necessarily work for you or us. But what do I know? I know messaging like nobody's business and I know customer psychology. And I know for a fact that I don't want a live launch because it is chaotic and it is risky and is unpredictable.
Nicki: I know that I want to support people in making the purchase instead of Penalizing them or giving them, you know, fake deadlines and, and all that, that kind of thing. Those make me, those make me nuts. But.
Claire: Me too. That's why I'm like loving this.
Nicki: So what I did was , I created it to sell that the copywriting course, which we still use it till the copywriting course occurred.
Nicki: And, and in 2018 [00:22:00] for the copywriting course, I made 40, 000 that year through the course, which was the most I'd ever made with that course, which was 2019.
Claire: It was people that like, It is. That is the life goal of many people trying to work for themselves, creating that. And then in
Nicki: 2019, I made 268, 000.
Nicki: And then in 2020, huh. In 2020, I made 1. 6 million just by implementing that system, which is now what we're talking about, which we now call the circuit sales system.
Claire: Yeah.
Nicki: and it started by me going, well, now, Wait a minute here. All of the things that I had been hearing with, you know, it's gospel.
Nicki: You have to live launch and you have to do with this and going, wait, that doesn't, that doesn't work for me. It doesn't work for my audience. What can I do instead? And how do I want my business to look instead of, you know, You know, one, one wild launch, live launch a year, a couple of wild live launches a year and all that stress and unpredictability and, and then also [00:23:00] to making my audience wait six months to get the offer that I have to give them, which by the way, most people don't wait.
Nicki: They just. Buy from your competition. that was kind of the, the cattle, but it is like we're saying, it's that the catalyst for me was taking that step back and going, wait, why am I trying all this stuff? Or it's fine to try stuff, but if it doesn't work. Move on to the next thing, because it absolutely is possible to have a very successful business.
Nicki: We have a multi seven figure per year business. Very happy, very proud of it. Still growing. Thank you. It's possible, but it's not possible if you try to just blindly follow all of the things that people, and it's not your fault if you're blindly following, because a lot of the messaging is you can just blindly follow this.
Nicki: No, it's not. You have to figure out what actually works, what actually works for your audience, and what works for your lifestyle. If you're live launching, and it's working for you, and you love it, then [00:24:00] great! Great! But if it's not? Then you have to find a different way. You know, no, I'm just totally going on a tear here, but I feel very strongly about this.
Nicki: It's got to say something to us that we are the only industry that relies on live launching like this. The. Only one, right? It's not like Apple puts out an Apple watch and goes, okay, you've got a week to get it. And then if you come back after a week, best of luck. See you again next year. Like that's not how it works.
Nicki: And that has to be a red flag for us that for some reason, we're like, okay, no, it's totally reasonable to only offer my course or my course. Program or whatever, one week a year, or you can only buy it one week, a year or one week, a quarter, something like that. It doesn't make sense.
Claire: not for the, you know, the people that are building, but you do see like the Amy Porter fields of the world.
Claire: She can put because one week uh, [00:25:00] signing up for 37 for an incredible, yeah, I know. And so, unfortunately that resonates. To other audiences, and I think she's fantastic, but I do agree with you that everyone has to customize Their sale
Nicki: program. and I agree. Amy Porterfield, amazing. Like the James Wedmore's, the Marie Forler's, all amazing.
Nicki: And I have learned from all of them. They're fantastic people. Brilliant. But they're also playing in a totally different league than the rest of us are. Absolutely. They deserve it.
Claire: You're, you're, you're playing up there now. So not quite there. Yeah. But you know what?
Claire: You are the, to the listener, the, like that, those, that scalability is incredible. So yes, I would say, let's go back to Nikki at 2018. Sure, sure. Yeah. And, and, and when that huge jump, I wanna know, and people are like, they're listening this episode, this is going to be the, like, where, what did she do? Mm-Hmm.
Claire: [00:26:00] Mm-Hmm. .
Nicki: it was this system that I created and taking that moment. but I was gonna say, is that, what works for the big people works for them partially because they are the big names, right? Like if someone wants to buy something, they will wait a year to get into James Wedmore's program.
Nicki: And absolutely, it's an amazing program. But they'll wait a year because he's James Wedmore. They'll wait a year because she's Marie Forleo, because she's Amy Porterfield. And absolutely, again, amazing programs. Invest in them. However, if you're not one of those people, or in that tier, We can't expect that our audiences are going to wait to purchase from us because they are be amazing, but it doesn't happen.
Nicki: You know, the, most of like we're saying when people are at that peak moment of excitement, what happens is we're like, Hey, Great. I'm so excited to see you on the list. Awesome. They're like, yeah, great. [00:27:00] What's your solution? I can't wait. And we're like, awesome. Yeah. Here's a free ebook. Oh, and come back in like three months, but I can give you that solution or six months or a year.
Nicki: And they don't, or the vast majority don't, what they do instead is they go, Oh, I want this. I understand now that there is a solution. And they go and they Buy from our competition.
Claire: Yeah.
Nicki: Just this weekend. I was looking for, I was like, I want to get like more creativity into my life. So I was looking for, for art courses and there are a lot of artists courses.
Nicki: Good to know. Good to know. Anyway, sorry. I have to, no, no, no. I'll have to get her. I had her
Claire: on the pod. She was one of my first. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. No, she's awesome.
Nicki: Yes. But so like, there are a lot. Out there and now I will check on her stuff, but I opened up a lot of tabs is doing a lot of looking and entered into, you know, a lot of email and, and, and some people were, they had the ability for me to purchase with a deadline, had the ability for me to purchase.
Nicki: And some people said, join my wait list. [00:28:00] Well, guess what? If I'm not in your program and they look roughly the same to me. If I know that I want the solution now, I don't, I'm not going to join your waitlist. I don't know when this is coming next. I purchased from somebody else. And that happens to us every day.
Nicki: When we say, Hey, get on our email list. Here's an ebook. This is such great. But they can't actually buy our main offer. They can't buy the thing that we've promised is going to give them that huge transition. They go and they find it somewhere else and we're all, well, not all of us many of us who are selling on that live launch model are, it's leaking revenue from us because they're going and buying from our competition.
Claire: Yeah. Because we're shopping in real time all the time. This is like restaurants, you know, you're not booking out at your everything we do. It's tomorrow or now I want to massage now. I want to get my nails done now. Yeah. [00:29:00] I love this because I think it's so easy to just be on the hamster wheel of what we hear, what we know and keep doing that.
Claire: So obviously we're. Anyone listening is like, yeah, okay. I am ready. I need this. Where can, like, can they buy today from you, Nikki? They can! Yes.
Nicki: Absolutely. We were not going to spend two weeks nurturing you or three weeks. It's, you can nurture, that's another thing too, you can nurture and sell at the same time.
Nicki: It is a, it is a it is not true that you have to do one and then the other. You can do both at the same time. But anyway yeah, you can go follow us at a circuit sales system on the socials, on Instagram, on Facebook, I think even on Tik TOK. I don't know. My team's amazing. They're on top of that.
Nicki: And if you want to see what it looks like from the inside, go to circuit selling. com and opt in and you can see what it looks like from, from the inside. It's a very meta experience. [00:30:00] I
Claire: am excited. So I'm on the page now. We'll have it in the show notes. Anyone listening, drive me your car. Do not. Pull out your phone right now and start taking notes.
Claire: Everything will be in the show notes and if you're on the email list, you will get this. And this is now, oh my goodness, this is so exciting. So to get the audience excited, what was one thing, one of the things without giving away your All of your hard work and pushing people, cause that's really what we're all here to do is what was maybe, you know, psychologically or something that was really a big game changer to jump from what your sales of the first year to um, 40, 000, to jumping to two.
Nicki: It was a, well, the first year. Yeah. So the first year that was what, like but over the course of that two years, it's a, it's a 40 X revenue increase. That's insane. Yes.
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Claire: [00:31:00] Without giving us a six hour course, you know, but like, what, what was it for you, Nikki? Because now I guess the question is, what was it for you, but like, [00:32:00] it worked for you.
Claire: Can it work for others?
Nicki: Yeah, absolutely. We have we have a podcast as well, which I probably shouldn't mention that energize your online business podcast. She's like, yeah maybe you want to talk about your podcast. Thanks Claire. Thank you. Kind of lobbed that one for me. Appreciate it. No, and we have, you know, our students.
Nicki: Come on there to, to talk about their wins all the time. We have one student who had a program that she never really sold. She kind of had it on her website. Nobody, she put, she built a circuit for it. And within a couple of months, I think within three months, she made 55, 000 with it without even really promoting it.
Nicki: And part of that, she was like just in Italy, getting the notifications on her phone on vacation in Italy. Another student who like, if you think my numbers are awesome, we have another student who she let us know. So obviously she's continued growing, but she let us know that once she got her system going in, in 2023, she was making, I want to say it's, oh, it's 400 percent of what she made in 2022.
Nicki: [00:33:00] Each month after she started implementing it in 2023, and then has just continued like, and it's Amazing. And don't get me wrong. I'm not saying that everybody's going to get like 400 percent of what they made last year. But, but what I am saying is that if you're Exactly. There's growth opportunities and you don't have to be on this risky, unpredictable live launch model, or if you want to, you can combine it with a live launch model.
Nicki: It can be flexible, but I think what I would say is that the piece of advice I would offer is really Look at your business and make sure that it's working for you. If it isn't, there are opportunities to change. And it's not just live launch or evergreen . There, there is a place where you can get the best of both without the worst of both.
Claire: as you've mentioned earlier, it's like, oh, okay, Nikki is now on the show here. This is another, you know, another tactic. I'm pretty [00:34:00] raw here, but what ultimately makes it different? it's so obvious talking to the passion and you're like, I want everyone to be successful.
Claire: Like you want to see people do well. And it's really, really evident, but you know, why is it different? It's
Nicki: combination of the way we approach messaging. Like I said, my background is in copywriting. I couldn't take out messaging if I tried. But even you couldn't because messaging is the foundation of effective sales.
Nicki: You can't have a business if you don't nail your messaging. So that's a big part of what we dig into. Really approaching messaging in a way that you have never approached it before. And then, combining that with messaging. psychological tactics and strategies that support people in making the purchase instead of trying to like force them to make it actually support them and help them understand why making the purchase is the logical choice.
Nicki: Love it.
Claire: And [00:35:00] we talked about this quickly offline because we are all inundated with everyone's telling us give free, free all the time, pretty much give your soul plus some of everything you're doing is the only way to build your email list, your audience whatever it is. What's the problem with that approach?
Nicki: So the biggest problem with that is that we've been told that you have to teach, teach, teach, right? And there are places like, yeah, if you need content for Instagram, you need content for social, absolutely throw in a little nugget of like, here you go. But when we bring them into our funnels, bring them into our workflows, and we try to teach them, right?
Nicki: The problem is, is that fundamentally learning is an energy draining thing. It's, it just is, you know, when you think back to like high school, where you're like, yeah, I can't wait to go to class today. No, even when, even when we, as business owners and Claire, I know you do the same thing when you buy a course.
Nicki: Cause you're like, yeah, I want to learn. I want to learn that. Like, Oh, because we're always buying new courses. Absolutely. But you buy the [00:36:00] course and you're like, all right, great. Now I've got the course immediately. You go. Oh, now I have to go through the course. Oh, man. And then you have to go and you have to, if you're a good business owner, you go and you schedule it out so you actually go through it.
Nicki: Or you do the first hour and you're like, okay, I think I
Claire: know.
Nicki: Yeah. Because learning is an energy draining activity. There absolutely, obviously is a place for learning, but that place for learning is After they have made the purchase where we can support them in learning and like encourage them to keep putting the putting the effort in and getting the outcome, the place before it is where, like I was talking about is, is those.
Nicki: Place for those light bulb moments for what we call it, the paradigm shifts. Exactly. Because beforehand, you know, it's drains their energy, it takes them from that peak excitement and it drains their energy. And on top of the fact that you also have to, if you try to, you know, give them a little win and then they'll purchase the big one.
Nicki: No. What happens is you get [00:37:00] people who are like, I have this little win. Okay, great. Thanks for the little one. I really need to focus on this little win. So like, yeah, maybe I'll come back at home. Maybe I'll come back and buy that big win later . the other part is the others like, oh, okay, I've got a small win. And they go, all right, now I understand how to get the small win.
Nicki: So like, okay, I think I can figure out that big win. So I don't need to purchase. they probably can't, but because you're like, all right, here you go. Here's your small win. That's and see how easy that was. Great. They're like, Oh, all right. If that was easy, I can figure out that big one. And then they don't need you.
Nicki: So it's, that teaching as a method of sales. And I understand why we all come back. Number one, cause it's what we're told to do. But number two, we're all. you have a program, if you have a course, you're used to teaching, right? Like that's your comfort zone. You have information, you're used to conveying information, telling people how to do it.
Nicki: Absolutely. It makes sense, but that's not teaching is different from marketing and to try to combine the [00:38:00] two is doing your business a major disservice.
Claire: I know. I'm like, Oh my gosh, I can't believe it's what we've been going for 45 minutes. Oh my goodness. There's so many more questions. Okay. We're going to end with one last question. If. For whatever reason, this isn't sticky enough this episode to go and click on the link and be part of Nikki K media's worlds.
Claire: What's one thing at least that they, you can tell them today that will sit with them long enough that when they're ready, they will come back here because I think it's all timing, right? Like the timing might not be right now, but what's one thing that you know that will resonate All the students that you've helped, why they come back, what is one thing we can leave with them today?
Nicki: I think that, and this is, this is [00:39:00] probably going to be, be very broad, but it's actually something that I really wish someone had said to me earlier in my business career is that it's just, they're going to be times when it's hard. But it's also always still possible. There aren't business is not a mystery.
Nicki: And I think that some of us kind of are like, Ooh, cross my fingers. it's not about wishing and hoping. It's not about as much as I believe in, you have to believe it's possible. And it's, but it's not about, magic. It's business is actually fundamentally very simple.
Nicki: it gets complicated in the execution, but finding an audience that has money to pay for things, and then finding something that they want to buy, and then serving it up to them in a way that entices them to purchase it. And then, of course, you get into, all right, making sure it's the right number, and making sure it's all this, and all that kind of stuff.
Nicki: But fundamentally, There's no magic to it. And they're going to be really good days and they're going to be hard days. And they're going to be days when you're [00:40:00] super excited and they're going to be days when you are scared, no matter how big your business gets. Exactly. I kind of always thought that at a certain point it was going to get like easy or at a certain point I was going to stop being scared, but the bigger your business gets, you just, now you just start to, Like expect it like, okay, this is one of those days or one of those like, yeah,
Claire: you've done enough times.
Claire: The muscles have been built.
Nicki: Exactly. Exactly. But the, the, the thing is, is that no matter what your goal is. It's possible you just have to tweak the inputs to get the right output. So the good news is, is that you could take that part off the table. They're like, is this really possible? Yeah, it is. It absolutely is.
Nicki: Now you just need to go back and figure out the inputs, get the right inputs, massage how you do things to get that output that you want. But that output, whatever it is your goal is, whatever it is you want, it's absolutely [00:41:00] possible. So the good news is that part you don't have to worry about. Now you can focus on getting all the elements of your business right.
Claire: And you know what? I think that's what we need to hear today. I think more than ever. I needed to hear that. I hit these and you're like, I need to hear it sometimes. I need to say it to myself sometimes. Yeah. I don't care. I agree. I don't care where you are on the journey. It's like, sometimes you're like you do being like, you know what?
Claire: Maybe this is the universe. Message to be like, stop doing this or keep doing this. And I think knowing it's possible, not, it's not this complete mystery. Failing many, many times is one of the best things because you pivot quickly, fail fast. And I think Nikki, you are. Awesome. It's one thing to see you scrolling through and reading your bios and everything, but to see you in real form still didn't come to me.
Claire: You'll get an email one of these days who you remind me of. I'll be like, yes. I just want to thank you for the work that [00:42:00] you put in because I know you've gone through a lot to come out on the other side of being like here. I know something that works because I did it and I've helped other people. I'm sure you'll see me on the inside soon into your world.
Claire: Very soon. And seeing you from afar, but being here. So I just want to say thank you for sharing this. And, and honestly, there's going to be a lot of people I know listening right now that you're not alone. That's a big message. I'm trying to push out this year. You're not alone. It's not as complicated as it might feel or scary because we have people like you, Nikki, that's creating the path for another chapter for people.
Claire: So thank you for the work you've done. And Those of you that are like, okay, I've pulled over the side of the road. Where do I sign up? I'm going to put in the show notes, all the information for you to join. Nikki's circuit sales system. That sounds. Awesome. And you're awesome. So thank you, Nikki, for being with [00:43:00] us today.
Nicki: Oh my gosh. Thank you, Claire. This was so much fun.
Claire: You're great.
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