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[00:00:00] Claire Bouvier: Hello everyone, and welcome back to another episode of the Small Town Entrepreneur Podcast. I'm excited. We're going to be talking about something that keeps coming up. When I looked back at all of my podcasts, this was a topic that was noted to be a peak in the analytics, and I really thought about it.
[00:00:19] I think it's a topic that keeps coming back, this idea of imposter syndrome. And so I thought I would dive a little deeper talking about it. It's something that Many neurodivergents do actually struggle with imposter syndrome. And if I'm to go back, way back as a little girl, I actually remember when I was little being told a lot that I was doing it wrong.
[00:00:46] So whether it was the way I added extra notes into my classical violin pieces when I was taking lessons, or the way I solved a math problem in class. Even though I got the [00:01:00] answer, it was the process. I remember over and over I was told I was doing wrong no matter how I figured it out. And then as I got older in life, I was corrected for the types of questions I would ask my teachers or The questions I was asking or the way as I got older, then I became a teacher myself and around me I was reprimanded for the styles or the introductions or the ways I change different methods or practices in the classroom.
[00:01:33] And. When you look over a certain period of time, that compounds, that, reassurance is the world telling you, you're doing something wrong. You start to believe it in times and think, how come everyone else seems to be doing it right? And I'm the one always being told, follow this process and you'll get, even though you have the right answer in the math, you have to do it this way.
[00:01:54] And that never seemed to work for me. [00:02:00] And as getting older with anything, we start to question these things and the ways, we were told whether it was right or not. And when we look at, so after I was diagnosed with ADHD at 30, and looking at
[00:02:20] It's interesting because it makes sense. The world has been designed in all aspects, from education to politics to social expectations. It's been designed for. a neurotypical world. And we hear this a lot. And, when, really roughly speaking, when I look at the statistics, when I did the research, it's something like a 1 to 6 to a 1 to 9 ratio, meaning that For every neurodivergent individual, there's going to be approximately six to nine non neurodivergent individuals.
[00:02:58] So of course that makes [00:03:00] sense. tHe world is being designed for the majority. And when we look at business, we look at education systems, They're serving the greater number. And so when we look back at imposter syndrome imposter syndrome is actually only introduced in the 1970s bicycle by psychologists, Pauline Clance and Suzanne Imes.
[00:03:21] I
[00:03:27] apologize if I mispronounced that. But what was really interesting, the research that they started to notice that despite having, individuals having adequate. external evidence of accomplishments of whatever from anything. Certain individuals actually showed that they're, that they couldn't internalize that success.
[00:03:50] And so it started to coin the idea of imposter syndrome, attributing it to individuals thinking it's a lack of luck or timing [00:04:00] rather than their own ability.
[00:04:07] So it's interesting because the imposter syndrome actually was first identified not until the 1970s by two psychologists Pauline Clance and correct me if I'm wrong saying this, Suzanne Imes. And they noticed that despite having adequate external evidence of accomplishments for an individual, there were certain individuals that Indiana, the beauty of it is that helping her fight to become the next president in her manufacturing first world challenges, the Foodbank world, and even and places in the world to help her fight for to become the next president of the United States.
[00:04:44] There's no question. Of course, not everyone's going to be happy with that decision, but if she can look at it like this. Imposter syndrome can, a lot of the time, be a motivator [00:05:00] to drive us to working harder or to, avoid being unmasked. This isn't typically the case for neurodivergent individuals that we've come to realize and those of us that are listening that are neurodivergent.
[00:05:14] For those of us with these neurodivergent minds. Imposter syndrome it can actually exacerbate feelings of, loneliness, alienation, self doubt as their unique way of processing the world around them and not conforming to these traditional, metrics of success that we look at, whether it's, in our work or in school.
[00:05:36] So it's really important that specifically neurodivergent women, especially entrepreneurs, that we're off on our own to develop these strategies, to overcome these inadequate feelings that recognize our value and our capabilities, even though the majority of the world might question or look at our methods and look at the way we're doing it.
[00:05:58] And it makes sense. [00:06:00] The world has been designed to accommodate the majority of non neurodivergent, divergent individuals. It's reasonable, but this can be really challenging, especially if we're neurodivergent, going through the education system, whether or not we are considered someone with ADHD or autism or dyslexia.
[00:06:22] The conventional teaching techniques and standardized testing formats are not going to cater to our unique learning styles, and it's starting to become much more discussed, and it's exciting. We are seeing the changes in the education system. If we look at our work environments, ever since the pandemic, we've seen a huge shift.
[00:06:41] It's a huge paradigm shift in this because many, before the pandemic, we noticed a lot of the workplace cultures and structures were completely tailored to the strengths and needs of a non. Neurodivergent employee. So we have the standard office hours, physical workspace setups, we have typical [00:07:00] communication methods not really very conducive for the productivity of a neurodivergent individual.
[00:07:09] And even let alone the social norms and expectations and, the understanding of neurodivergence It's really changed anything from our health care systems to all these things. There's obviously, there is a gap there and we're starting to really recognize, we're having more awareness around Neurodiversity and how these individuals and stigmas and all these taboos have been created and how we can break them down and looking at how, this idea of imposter syndrome is actually could be turned into a beautiful thing.
[00:07:43] It's an asset having, ourselves having to force to look inwards and recognize how this looks. So we can talk, the statistics and we can look at, woe is me, our stories, and we can look at why, things aren't set up for the neural divergence in this world. But at the same [00:08:00] time, until we You know, have a perfect world, which we can't ever wait for that to happen.
[00:08:05] We have to do the work ourselves. We have to go in and really challenge the way we think, the way we operate. Because if we get drowned out by imposter syndrome, it will totally kill all the beautiful creativity, the innovation, and the creative mind that's gonna allow beautiful things to emerge. The first thing is really...
[00:08:26] My light almost fell there. Sorry. The first thing is to really recognize that as a neurodivergent, as someone that, thinks differently, approaches problem solving problems and everything in a different way, we have to recognize that strength. Despite, you've been told your whole life, you're not doing it right, or you should be doing like this, or why do you think like that, or all these things, we have to start to recognize that actually that should be a win.
[00:08:53] It's, Understanding, embracing your neurodivergent identity [00:09:00] is really crucial. And that it's not a reflection of, your failures or, whatever it is in life that it should be actually something celebrated. So the first step is just to be like appreciating the brain that you do have and acknowledging these feelings with other people that are in similar.
[00:09:22] Spaces and similar headsets and headsets, headspaces and mindsets that share that neurodivergent mind is really Powerful and helpful as you go through that journey. So that first step is just recognizing that your neurodivergent brain is a strength. Number one, because we need you. We need you to challenge the way things are done, the way things are working from education system to workplace, to healthcare.
[00:09:54] The second one is really always. Catching yourself in it's common for those of us with [00:10:00] imposter syndrome to really get into negative thinking traps And I've talked about this in other episodes and after 10 years of you know Doing cognitive behavioral therapy and really looking at what are the common negative thoughts?
[00:10:13] Neurodivergent mind specifically with imposter syndrome. This is one of the results of this can we can start to spiral into? negative thinking and The most important thing is to identify when that it is happening and to start to noticing what's happening around you So the first thing is that you have to stop you have to reset, you know Your brain and question the validity of your thought and ask yourself, you know Where did I get this information?
[00:10:43] Is this something I made an assumption about? Did someone tell me? If I ask a valid person, someone I trust, ask a really trusted friend, someone that you trust and say, this is what I'm thinking. And if they're like, you're nuts, then you have to remember that you have to change [00:11:00] that thinking and Not only that, replace it with a positive affirmation about whether it's your strengths, your achievements, the why you're, the way you're thinking and not worrying about everybody else all the time, but focusing on what can I do to counter that feeling of inaq inadequacy under qualification by actually just saying, hey, but these are the things I do bring to the table.
[00:11:23] These are the things, these are my unique abilities. You really have to focus that. Statistically proven on paper, the data says you are, as someone maybe that suffers a lot of imposter syndrome, falls into the neurodivergent, spectrum, it's common that you're going to fall into these negative thinking traps.
[00:11:43] And so you have to stop it and change the way you're thinking. A huge thing that has helped me is finding, I'm a part of ADHD groups I'm a part of entrepreneurs, women that are neurodivergent brains that we, how we [00:12:00] operate, how we work is having that supportive network is just vital, especially if we look at the ratio of, I know at a given time, if I go out to the world and, I see that all the time, if I sit at a table with other people or join something, I know when I'm feeling different when, I'm not following the norm or I'm always questioning it, It can make you uncomfortable and you ask yourself what's wrong with me?
[00:12:26] But when you're around that supportive network, when you're with people that understand you with mentors, it's really important to be able to share your similar experiences and to be reminded that you're not alone. And having that guidance and sense of belonging and being like, okay. This is okay. It's really important.
[00:12:47] So find a neurodivergent, find someone that is like you, that is a mentor, someone that you can check in with. I know for me on my entrepreneurial goals and actually it's not just [00:13:00] entrepreneurial, it's all the things. I have a dear friend. Every Monday at 9 30 AM, we go on FaceTime or in person and we say, we give a debrief over last week and then we talk about the week coming, setting our goals, our struggles, all the things.
[00:13:18] And it's nice to bounce that off. So there's that accountability. There is that a sense of if we got into a negative thinking trap, it's completely debunked and it's no, you're not going down that route. Let's go in this route. And so that having that mentorship, having that friendship, having that accountability partner has been incredible for growth in all the aspects of my life.
[00:13:43] So I encourage you to find that person. If it's five, 10 minutes a week, even you just check in and you have that accountability. The next one is celebrate. All the achievements, all the wins, I don't care if it's like you remembered for a whole week to take your [00:14:00] vitamin D especially going into the darkened seasons, like that's a win.
[00:14:04] Maybe it's, you got up at a certain time or, you've journaled something. It's really important. Just acknowledge big or small. And I really can't. Emphasize that enough. Is that big or small? Some weeks, I had a mentor when I was a teacher and I really liked what he said. He said, Claire, teaching isn't always about giving gourmet food every day.
[00:14:27] Some days it's cafeteria. Sometimes it's a buffet. And, you get lucky and you have that gourmet. And I think that's the thing is we have to show up every day and it's not always going to be this gourmet perfect day. And so we just have to celebrate those little wins, the big wins, the little wins.
[00:14:45] Over time when we celebrate and take a moment to say, and how do we celebrate and maybe it's through gratitude or it's saying, I'm really proud of myself or something, just having that self talk. If you do something very teeny every day, big or small, [00:15:00] you are going to build that self confidence and that self image.
[00:15:04] And over time, that voice. of imposter syndrome or that voice, the negative saying you're not good enough. You're never going to succeed, blah, blah, blah. It actually gets smaller and smaller over time. You just have to practice it. You have to start training that brain to shift your focus from what you perceive as an inadequacy to actually your accomplishments and your success and your abilities.
[00:15:33] Celebrating the completion of a small project, whether it's personal or with business or with work document this. Keep track of these successes and look back and think, okay, this will give you a momentum. The next is to embrace that learning brain that you have, that you're craving new information all the time.
[00:15:55] And it's this weird space because for a neurodivergent mind, [00:16:00] learning, Is a continuous and enjoyable process. We thrive on always learning. That's what keeps us, the adrenaline going and the excitement. We're never stagnant. And, but the thing is embracing this aspect can be both a challenge.
[00:16:16] as an opportunity for growth. Because the imposter syndrome, it seems like the more you know, the more you feel inadequate because you're realizing, oh my goodness, the more I keep learning, the more I'm recognizing how little I know, and so you never get to that point being like, I'm an expert, I know this stuff, but you have to remember as someone with a very neurodivergent mind, learning you're always going to be learning, and so it's hard to say, okay, at this point, I'm going to be okay with sharing this much about what I know.
[00:16:48] And, at the end of the day, it's about really accepting that not knowing everything is completely normal. And to be okay with that because there's a lot of stuff to [00:17:00] know in the world and we have to just own a purse, a little bit of it and really be comfortable with that. And it takes time. Embracing that learning part of our brain, but also recognizing that there is a point that you can share it, that you're, you are an expert, you are good at that.
[00:17:15] And to be okay with that and to recognize that balance. Something that can be very difficult. Because of the grandiose thinking as a neurodivergent, we get caught into these big goals. So it's important to set realistic goals. That is so crucial. It's understanding that, as a perfectionist, as, we really want to get it right, It's just simply unattainable and that making mistakes is going to be part of the journey.
[00:17:45] And sometimes Elizabeth Gilbert wrote in Big Magic, a fantastic book. And she said, it was along the lines is I'm bad at quoting exactly, sometimes good is enough. It's better to have it done as a [00:18:00] neurodivergent. Then just to keep attaining this perfectionism and never completing it.
[00:18:06] And so depending on the listener right now, that has, take with a grain of salt because for neurodivergent, we could just obsess over it and obsess, always keep. Achieving for the unattainable. But a certain point we have to say, okay, set a realistic goal. When this is completed, it's done.
[00:18:26] So having those realistic goals and expectations for yourself is really crucial in overcoming imposter syndrome. So whether it's setting a very specific milestone for a project and that maybe later there's some refinement that has to happen or changes and really. So when you're setting these goals, make sure you know that it's going to take longer than what you think.
[00:18:49] And there's going to be so many other details, but the most important thing is setting a goal that you truly will be okay with and that there is a timestamp on it and that you can look back [00:19:00] and say, this is completed. When I get to this point, it's completed and celebrate that. Now, lastly. Actually, there's a lot more I could talk about, but I think that the last two that I'm going to focus on is that I'm saying this, and this is really hard for me.
[00:19:20] It's something that I've been told my whole life, Clare, you are too hard on yourself. So if you're someone that is too hard on yourself, practicing self compassion is, doesn't come easy. I'm constantly showing up every day trying to be a little kinder to myself, especially during challenging times thinking, Oh my goodness, why can't I be like everyone else?
[00:19:41] And why is this always happening to me? It is a very powerful tool when it comes to, defeating certain things as maybe your self criticism or the self talk is so crucial. So maybe your first week is just acknowledging how you talk to yourself. What are your [00:20:00] thoughts? What, like documenting, being aware of how you're talking to yourself.
[00:20:03] I know for a long time, I would say, Oh, I'm an idiot. Even getting into that habit saying, Oh, can't believe I did that. I had to, I have to still consciously, I have to say no, I did that because, or, that's okay that I did it. This was my reasoning. And so having those setbacks and, making that easier.
[00:20:24] In the journey and as you're going through dealing with imposter syndrome, it's really important to just be gentle with yourself because as we know, the harder we are on ourselves, we are the hardest people on ourselves and then it turns into anxiety or stress and sickness and it just, it gets worse.
[00:20:41] So you know, after a really hard day or, instead of being really beating yourself up, recognize. What you've learned from the experience. Maybe the effort you put in and how it didn't turn out. Change the way you think. And lastly, can't stress enough, you hear [00:21:00] about the mood board or the vision board.
[00:21:02] Have something, put it somewhere, visualize success. Visualize what success is for you. It is After years and years, there's lots of research and works of other intelligent people that say, visualization is a very powerful technique for building confidence and overcoming your feelings of anything along the imposter syndrome, inadequacy, especially for the neurodivergent mind focuses you to imagine yourself succeeding in your goals and feeling those associated positive emotions, which is really important.
[00:21:42] And again, it's creating those feelings of positive emotions that we can keep feeding off of. It could be as simple as visualizing, delivering a really successful talk at the, or comment at your next meeting, or completing a major project with [00:22:00] confidence and seeing it through to very end of completion.
[00:22:04] These are all different things. that are so important to help us overcome imposter syndrome. And if we know that the world is designed as a neural divergent, it's designed to accommodate another type of brain, then we have to be gentle to ourselves. We have to recognize and we have to create new rules for ourselves and new things that allow us to grow and to...
[00:22:32] Essentially thrive in our own worlds, and it's awesome. You can see things are shifting in the way education systems are being built in different parts of the world and how our workplaces are changing. So there is so much excitement as we go into these new. Decades of entrepreneurship. So if you're listening and you can totally relate as a neurodivergent, maybe you can't, someone that does [00:23:00] struggle with imposter syndrome, send them this episode.
[00:23:02] I want to know what they think. I want them. I want you to not feel alone because you're not alone. This is something that has weighed on me my entire life, but I can promise you by practicing these different things. I've talked about in this episode. I feel confident for the most part. Most days I, I feel good and I'm proud of myself, but of course we get stuck into that negative traps and then I have to climb back out of that, that ditch and come back to, a place of positivity.
[00:23:32] So you're not alone on this journey. I am here. We are in this together. Thank you for tuning in to this neurodivergent episode on the small town entrepreneur podcast. As always, I really appreciate being here. I'm Claire Bouvier, your host, and I will see you next week. Cheers.
